Better Handling of Music Library

[SJ]

Hi all!
I've been using MusicBee for quite some time now, and I'm loving it. However, I'm also having a few issues regarding how it handles my music library. I'd like to talk about a few options that I hope would benefit many other users as well. I believe that these options are quite straightforward and easy to implement. (By the way, I've gone through the recent update logs of 2.0 beta and have seen a few improvements that might be on similar issues, but I think my issues are still relevant). The post is gonna be long so that my issues are communicated well. Please bear with.

I've used MediaMonkey before, for quite some time too. As such here I might point to a few similarities or differences between the two programs to better illustrate my points. Though I've used some other applications previously, MediaMonkey, I think, was the first one to have provided me with most of the options I hoped for. Though that was enough to keep me stuck to it, there were reasons to look for a better option. To say the least, MusicBee has offered much more than I had previously hoped to get, and it is perhaps not necessary to mention all that here. Rather, I do miss a couple of options I got used to during my tryst with MediaMonkey and I would like to focus on those.

1. I'd like to start with one simple problem I've had with MusicBee: I have a large number of songs that have more than one artists (2, 3...). MusicBee tends to lock the combined artist information in many places (though the Track Browser filters include such songs when looking for one artist). If I take a look at library stats, MB shows track counts or play counts against artists A and B this way:
A : 10 tracks - 5 plays
B : 8 tracks - 3 plays
A-B : 5 tracks - 2 plays
B-A : 3 tracks - 2 plays ...etc
This simply makes the information incomplete and confusing, considering how things can look like with a large number of artists and artists combination (A-B, A-C, A-B-C...). In this case, I have 18 total tracks by artist A, be it solo or duet. This is one thing MediaMonkey used to handle the right way. However, the best of both worlds is also welcome:
A: 18 tracks - 9 plays
B: 16 tracks - 7 plays
A-B (alphabetically) : - 8 tracks - 4 plays

2. Another problem I've noticed can be the result of a similar issue: while tagging from MusicBee, it does something similar. When I try to type a name, the auto-complete options also show combined results (i.e. A, A-B, A-C, etc). Now, if I want to put two artist names AA and DD, MB will allow me to choose AA first, which is good (provided that AA has solo songs in library). Then, after I put a separator, it won't show the auto-complete options for the next artists I might add. That is, only if I have "AA; DD" in a previous song, then I can choose that, otherwise I would have to choose the first artist and then add the other artists manually. Again, MediaMonkey does handle this correctly, which prompts me to hope it can be implemented.

Now, that's just a couple of issues I'm having. But the best thing about MusicBee, IMHO, is the customization and randomization it offers to the users. Taking this to be MB's strengths, I'd like to mention a few options that might take thing a few steps further.

3. MB already has a nice and powerful auto-playlist option, and the "different/same artist" option is really very useful. Though there are filters for more customizations, what if the value after "different/same" can be customized? That is, "different/same" artist/album/composer/genre........
And what if the number of "different/same" can be customized too?? That is: 1) same artist 2) different album 3) same year/decade 4) different composer 5) different genre...................... Maybe too much to expect, but is it too difficult to implement? 
Also, while I'm at it let me mention that I've seen that when I slide towards same artist, MB repeats that artist a lot: AAABAACAAADAA..... I would like the artist to be played frequently, but not necessarily repeatedly. I suppose that the "gap before same artist can repeat" option now handles this?? 

4. One more thing, the duplicate manager allows to hide or replace tracks with reference. The issue I'm having has been mentioned in the forum before, without much result I guess. What if I don't want to delete the original files and want the changes to be made in the library only? Can it be this way that all the versions of the song still shows but the statistics are merged/copied. That is, when I play one song, all the other duplicates also get counted to be played as many times?? Being able to choose the preferred version will also be useful (we already can choose versions to be hidden, right?).

5. Then, the A-Z jump bar is good, but the problem is it sorts by a certain category, e.g. if I have sort by Album Artist set up, it would go to the first album artist with 'S' when I click on 'S'. This is normal, but is this too useful? I mean the track browser is just below it, and can utilize this option. Say, when I press 'S', all the columns shift to 'S' without actually filtering. That is, I can immediately see artists, albums, composers, (anything) starting with 'S', while the default behavior is retained. I can't help thinking that this can actually relieve us off the need to type in words in the search field.

6. Finally, just a little issue... The lyricist tag is one I use a lot, and it is not treated well in MB. Track browser cannot sort by Lyricist, and the tag editor cannot auto-complete lyricist information. The only way to streamline searches is to actually search by lyricist... Considering the touching words we love in many songs, this field can get more love I guess.... 

Well, I do feel that I should have mentioned the numerous ways that MusicBee has satisfied most of my needs, but the post is already too long. So I'd repeat that these are just what I feel after using MusicBee, MediaMonkey and a few other applications. I'm not complaining, certainly, but do think that these options will make MB better and even more useful without the need for drastic changes.

Thanks for your time. 

[Zak]

For 2:

If you click the "..." button next to the artist field and enter names there you will get an auto-complete menu for each one. Takes a little more clicking, but might save a little time for long entries or tracks with lots of collaborators.

[SJ]

For 2:

If you click the "..." button next to the artist field and enter names there you will get an auto-complete menu for each one.

Yes, I've noticed it, and it sort of helps as we need not type by hand. But then again, there is a separate "display artist" option which remains the same... unless, again we type in or copy-paste. We'd like to display the edited version generally... right?
This brings up the question, "display artist" is a good option, but is it treated as a separate tag field in MB? Then does any other application recognize this field, say other players or Mp3Tag?

Anyway, thanks for looking into my issues. Any idea about the other problems I mentioned? MB being so much customizable, some of the issues might have a not-so-straightforward solutions which I might have missed... 

[Zak]

Mp3tag should show any tag added by MusicBee. "DISPLAY ARTIST" definitely appears and can be edited. I'm  not sure if this is a tag that is recognised by other programs though. I think "ARTISTSORT" and "ALBUMARTISTSORT" are more commonly used for that purpose.

Everything else you asked about would need to be implemented as new features - I can't think of any way to work around them now, but other people might be able to suggest something. That, and er... I have no idea what you meant in point #5. 

[SJ]

I have no idea what you meant in point #5. 

That's kinda sad...  ...coz I was trying to be as elaborate as I could, though in the end I had to cut it short keeping in mind the length of the post... 

Anyway, I meant to say that in the main library view, you can sort by album, album artist, artist, etc. and the A-Z jump bar helps to, well, 'jump' to a letter, say 'S'. However, at any time, it would work on any one field, i.e. album, artist or album artist. I use the track browser a lot which lets you set up a number of columns to sort the music library... So, I was hoping if the A-Z jump option worked on the track browser too, maybe not selecting anything, but just scrolling down to the letter 'S' for all the columns, then that would be quite nice and useful. You know, you would have to scroll a lot to reach to 'S', be it for artist, album or whatever. Does it make sense as an option? 

Also, can you tell me the specific field name for "display artist", say in Mp3Tag? I could not find it.......... 

[paq]

My "solution" to 1 and 2 is the following:

I try not to have any artist tags in my library along the lines of Timbuktu feat. Promoe, Fort Minor; Lupe Fiasco; Holly Brook and so on. Instead I click the ... button in the artist field and list all related artists there and I make sure the field "display artist" is equal to the first listed (main) artist for that track. That is, when you close that window it will look like there isn't any other artists associated with that track in the Tag Editor, but there will be an * next to "artist:" hinting there is.

Now, auto-complete won't give me values with multiple artists (eg "In Flames; Soilwork") but this makes it easier imo when adding all related artists to a track in that "Multiple Artist Splitter"-window, since auto-complete will only show every unique artist n your library, no combinations of them.

Now you may ask or wonder, how do I browse all tracks by both "Alter Bridge" and "P.O.D."? The answer may not be intuitive but what I do is that I set up the track browser to show two or more columns and set each of them to Artist. In the first column I would then choose "Alter Bridge" and if P.O.D. is on any track together with them they would appear in next column. If choose "P.O.D." there I would see in my lower right corner how many tracks in total they made together (which is zero in this case ).

Regarding 1. and using this method, you won't be able to see in your Library Statistics how many tracks and plays two (or more) artists have made together. But you will be able to see how many tracks and plays there is for each and every artist. That is because the value of "display artist" is sort of treated as an artist itself in MusicBee.

[cartman005]

I like your ideas, particularly 1 and 2.

Regarding the Display Artist, it is a tag only used by MusicBee just as many other music applications create a few proprietary tags.

Previously, the Display Artist was only used internally by MusicBee's database. I was one of the users who originally requested that Display Artist become treated as a tag in each music file for the rare case that MusicBee does not close correctly, the changes would not be saved and all Display Artist changes could be lost. Treating it as a tag also makes it easier to transfer songs between multiple MusicBee installations.

[Zak]

I was hoping if the A-Z jump option worked on the track browser too, maybe not selecting anything, but just scrolling down to the letter 'S' for all the columns, then that would be quite nice and useful. You know, you would have to scroll a lot to reach to 'S', be it for artist, album or whatever. Does it make sense as an option? 

Ah, now I understand. I agree that this makes sense as an option. In fact I agree so much that I've cranked my Delorean up to 88mph and requested exactly the same thing six months ago:

http://getmusicbee.com/forum/index.php?topic=5743.0

Unfortunately the thread turned into a request for something else, but I'm still hoping it will be reassessed one day.

Also, can you tell me the specific field name for "display artist", say in Mp3Tag? I could not find it.......... 

Really? I just added a Display Artist tag to a track in MusicBee and when I looked at the same track in Mp3tag it had a new "DISPLAY ARTIST" tag. 

I try not to have any artist tags in my library along the lines of Timbuktu feat. Promoe, Fort Minor; Lupe Fiasco; Holly Brook and so on.

The other common approach is to move non-primary artists into the title. So instead of:

Title = Titanium
Artist = David Guetta (featuring Sia)

you have

Title = Titanium (featuring Sia)
Artist = David Guetta

which prevents David Guetta (especially David Guetta!) having two dozen entries on any artist list. The disadvantage is that you can't search for the guest artists by name.

[SJ]

I make sure the field "display artist" is equal to the first listed (main) artist for that track.

Well, for me, both the artists are "main" in most cases, and that's why I want both to show up everywhere actually. But the way you mentioned you browse, through the track browser, is what I already do. I generally use Mp3Tag for editing (previously MediaMonkey used to mess a lot with my tags), but if this thing worked correctly, I would have considered shifting to the in-built tag editor, which I do use sometimes. One thing more: can you tell me if I can change the default separator (\\) used by MusicBee? ";" separator has worked the best for me so far, as some of the separators make it impossible to know the second artist in Windows Explorer (both are 'main' artists, remember?  ). Also, in such cases (two separate artist tags as shown in Mp3Tag) the second artist info sometimes gets omitted totally if the file is converted.

Display Artist, it is a tag only used by MusicBee

Oh, I see. Then, it can't be edited or seen externally?

In fact I agree so much that I've cranked my Delorean up to 88mph and requested exactly the same thing six months ago:

http://getmusicbee.com/forum/index.php?topic=5743.0

That's so nice to learn that the features I'm thinking of are not all exceptional.  I somehow missed the thread, I think, as it was not my primary concern as such.

I just added a Display Artist tag to a track in MusicBee and when I looked at the same track in Mp3tag it had a new "DISPLAY ARTIST" tag. 

I checked it too, and it does show up. but previously I was trying to see if I can add this as a tag in Mp3Tag and could not find it. 

The other common approach is to move non-primary artists into the title. So instead of:

Title = Titanium
Artist = David Guetta (featuring Sia)

you have

Title = Titanium (featuring Sia)

I already do this if the second artist is not the primary artist. But as I already mentioned, most often that is not the case.

Anyway, for me, (as I handle tags externally most often), though the tag handing problems, if resolved, would be nice, I would particularly love to see the 3rd point I mentioned implemented. I guess that would almost cover any kind of combination one would expect...... 

[SJ]

On a second thought on the multiple artists problem, what about this: we can already split the "display artist" field into separate artist fields. But once we change those fields, if we have an refresh ('update' only for 'display artists') option which will allow us to refresh the "display artists" field according to the separate artist fields, then things would be as expected (considering that we expect all the artists to be 'displayed'). Is it not an easier workaround?