Ability to choose how playlist will be sorted when auto-exported

[toomanynights]

Hello!

TL;DR: would be nice to be able to control the sorting of auto-exported playlists. Currently it's always "in order of adding".

Having a blast with MusicBee and all its various functions. Me and my ol' lady, we like to listen to custom playlists when road tripping; the only problem is that shuffling makes it so some songs are played more often than others, and I found solution for that: MusicBee! I have built a multi-step sorting rules that, connected to syncing play count from last.fm, make certain that the most neglected songs end up on top of the list, so we can just listen to the playlist in order MusicBee arranged it to be, without shuffling, and the problem is solved.

There's one small issue with that approach however. All my playlists are exported automatically in .m3u format so I could play them from my phone. And their auto-exported versions are always sorted in order of addition to the playlist. Yes, I can export manually and then the order will be preserved; but I have several dozens of playlists, exporting every each one by hand takes a lot of time, and besides, MB will rewrite them with auto exports again.

I wish the auto export would preserve whatever sorting I set for the playlist, and trigger when that sorting changes (not only when new songs are added). Thanks a lot!

PS: it was already discussed here. But as the playlist number grows, it gets more and more tiresome to export the playlists by hand.

[frankz]

To preserve whatever sorting you set for the playlist when it is auto-exported, right click the name of the playlist and select List->Update Natural Order.

You can also create auto-playlists based on your manual playlists (one for each or one for any combination of them or one for all of them) and set them to sort on the last played column in ascending order.  These will also auto-export the way you want.

You can also skip the manual playlists and create auto-playlists that only pull songs not heard since before a certain number of days to avoid putting songs you're not going to want to listen to anyway into the mix at all.

[toomanynights]

To preserve whatever sorting you set for the playlist when it is auto-exported, right click the name of the playlist and select List->Update Natural Order.

Thanks! However, since my sorting rules involve random numbers, as well as frequently changed information, this would lead to pretty much the same amount of work as manual export takes.

You can also create auto-playlists based on your manual playlists (one for each or one for any combination of them or one for all of them) and set them to sort on the last played column in ascending order.  These will also auto-export the way you want.

That would lead to double the amount of playlists, which I already have several dozens of  Not saying it's not doable, just not very manageable the more data there is.

[frankz]

There's no more management in auto-playlists.  You'd still only manage your manual, source playlists.  The management of auto-playlists is...uh...automatic.

What I do to reduce clutter is keep the source playlists for the auto playlists and playlist mixers that I actually listen to and export to my phone (some of which are auto playlists themselves) in a folder. 

[toomanynights]

There's no more management in auto-playlists.  You'd still only manage your manual, source playlists.  The management of auto-playlists is...uh...automatic.

Of course Here's what I meant by this: currently I have, let's say 40 playlists in "Playlists" view. When there's so many, it can take a while to find the one I need, but if there will be 80, half of which is "technical" playlist that don't any purpose other than to preserve sort order when exporting? That would clutter things quite a bit. And for me, MusicBee is, first and foremost, about logical and structured music storage.

What I do to reduce clutter is keep the source playlists for the auto playlists and playlist mixers that I actually listen to and export to my phone (some of which are auto playlists themselves) in a folder.  

Can you elaborate a bit? So you have source playlists not in a playlist folder, but somewhere else? How do you assign and de-assign them then?

[frankz]

I have a playlist folder that just houses my playlists that are sources for my auto-playlists and playlist mixers.  One folder - one line in the playlist explorer - no clutter.

Then the main list of playlists (all of the other lines in the playlist explorer column) are the auto-playlists that get generated from the playlists within that folder.  These are the playlists that get synched to my mobile device.

So from your description of your current setup, if you organized it this way, your playlist explorer would go from 40 lines to 41 (if you created an auto-playlist for each) or fewer if you created auto-playlists that combined the tracks from several manual playlists.

I think it's fairly common that people create playlists in a certain order and expect the songs to be played in that order.  I don't do that, but that's generally what play lists are.  That's why your wish is kind of a no-go for me - it would complicate this functionality for the common use of the feature.  If someone wanted to sort by album or something and forgot to restore the natural order, their playlist would be exported in the wrong (to them) order.

Rather than simply give a -1, I have given you two workarounds, one manual and one automatic.

[toomanynights]

Then the main list of playlists (all of the other lines in the playlist explorer column) are the auto-playlists that get generated from the playlists within that folder.  These are the playlists that get synched to my mobile device.

I had no idea playlist folders were a thing. This changes quite a bit. Thank you!

I think it's fairly common that people create playlists in a certain order and expect the songs to be played in that order.  I don't do that, but that's generally what play lists are.  That's why your wish is kind of a no-go for me - it would complicate this functionality for the common use of the feature.  If someone wanted to sort by album or something and forgot to restore the natural order, their playlist would be exported in the wrong (to them) order.

Of course, I wouldn't suggest to change something that could lead to suffering of those who have different setups   However, there's no contradiction here, there are two ways all could have their own with my suggestion applied:
1. They could sort by "natural order" - it would require remembering to do so, which I believe is still more straight-forward than having extra "sorting" auto-playlists.
2. This could be controlled by a setting "Export sorted by..." - which would default to "Natural order" but could be changed to "Displayed order" or something custom. This would be a solution to fit them all, and I think you'll agree that it's much easier and more straight-forward than the auto-playlist thing (which I'd never even think of without your advice - while a setting is simple and speaks for itself).

Rather than simply give a -1, I have given you two workarounds, one manual and one automatic.

True, and I really appreciate your advice. Folders I've already started to use; the auto playlist thing - I'll get to that as well, however I still think consider it a heavy workaround, so I'll keep hoping that the change discussed above could one day be implemented.

Thanks again for all your help!

EDIT: Oh my, "Playlist folders" even appear in "Include in playlist" sub-menu! What a sound advice, @frankz! My library just got way better and more useful thanks to you.

[frankz]

...a setting is simple and speaks for itself...

As you spend more time on the forum (and I hope you do), you'll come to understand that no setting is simple or speaks for itself. 

Each setting is a complication that leads to potential confusion.  Some will be confused and come here for help or to demand the program be simplified.  Many will be confused and simply abandon the program as "too complicated."

[toomanynights]

...a setting is simple and speaks for itself...

As you spend more time on the forum (and I hope you do), you'll come to understand that no setting is simple or speaks for itself. 

Each setting is a complication that leads to potential confusion.  Some will be confused and come here for help or to demand the program be simplified.  Many will be confused and simply abandon the program as "too complicated."

Why, I even read such a feedback not two days ago! And most of the responses said "you should switch to a less complicated program" 

MusicBee is what it is, a diverse, advanced tool with endless possibilities for customization. It will never fit those who look for something simple, no matter what you do - I got a feeling it was built for those who want maximum control over their rig. And it stroke me as odd that in a program such as this, there's no control over the order in which the playlists are exported (save for the workaround you've suggested). So I thought I'd suggest changing it. The decision on whether or not to do this is, of course, out of my control

As it is, it seems to me that the existing workaround raises far more questions than a setting would.

[frankz]

Fair enough, then.

-1 to the wish for me.