Author Topic: Tagging Multiple Album Versions - How Do You Do it?  (Read 2233 times)

Thalion Korvhas

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I am curious how other people handle multiple versions of the same album (s). If for example you have an entire discography of a bands original mastered releases & you also have remastered copies of the same albums (or several). For whatever reason, you keep both. How do you all tag them?

As my first attempt I tried this, for example: Artist tag 1 (Original Masters): Iron Maiden [OM]. Artist tag 2 (Remasters): Iron Maiden [2016 RM]. Then there are special editions such as deluxe or expanded that may be a different remastering, etc. I am not 100% sold on the example I provided. I also thought about using the album tag instead of the artist tag. But then I would have a mess of albums to sort through when I went to listen to something instead of distinct categories in the musicbee main window.

How do you all handle this?

psychoadept

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Personally, I would use a custom tag where I could enter a description/category for an album. Then I would make filters or playlists based on that tag to subdivide things. I'd also add the custom tag to my album definition so that each version is treated as a distinct album.
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Thalion Korvhas

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I have added a custom tag by defining a new tag called "Album Mastering" in custom 2 tag field.

https://imgur.com/yx9e6Vq
https://imgur.com/bQCj5p6

I tried to make a custom sort  - see virtual2 in the second screenshot. I made two copies of the same album but with different "Album Mastering" tags. But when I go to the muscibee main panel it groups the tracks from both albums under the same album.

https://imgur.com/2U0FWgr

How do I make the two albums sort seperately?

<Edit> I realized that I am not being as clear to what I would like to do as I think I am being. What I want to do is have one artist (I.E. Iron Maiden). Then I want to be able to easily (one or two mouse clicks) choose which album version to listen to (I.E. 1995 Reissue or 2016 Remaster). I want to try to minimize the clutter of 2, 3, 4, or 5 artists named Iron Maiden with special versions after the artist name. Also when I choose the artist, I do not want to see multiple copies of the same album (just different versions of it) side by side. If I have an entire discography with say 3 versions of the albums, it would be a real pain to have album 1 three times in a row next to each other then have album 2 with three versions of it next to each other, etc.

Maybe I think too much in terms of folder structure. Which is how I organize everything. I wish it were possible to choose an artist thumbnail, then have a thumbnail for each album version, then when you choose one of the album versions, the actual albums pop up. That would be ideal for me. But that functionality does not exist in any music organizer that I have seen.
Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 05:41:00 AM by Thalion Korvhas

Zak

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Generally, regardless of the reason I would avoid "overloading" something as fundamental as the Artist tag with additional information that doesn't really belong there. The mastering or release details are pertinent to the album, not the artist. It might seem like a way to achieve a desired outcome, but starting down that path will only cause you more grief in the long run.

As for achieving what you want, I'd create a custom tag and set it as the track sub-grouping header in either Albums or Album and Tracks view.
I'm a little confused though, as you've written these two contradictory statements:

Also when I choose the artist, I do not want to see multiple copies of the same album (just different versions of it) side by side. If I have an entire discography with say 3 versions of the albums, it would be a real pain to have album 1 three times in a row next to each other then have album 2 with three versions of it next to each other, etc.

I wish it were possible to choose an artist thumbnail, then have a thumbnail for each album version, then when you choose one of the album versions, the actual albums pop up.
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hiccup

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I wish it were possible to choose an artist thumbnail, then have a thumbnail for each album version, then when you choose one of the album versions, the actual albums pop up. That would be ideal for me. But that functionality does not exist in any music organizer that I have seen.

Instead of using 'showing the tracks directly under the selected album', you could use 'to the right of the main panel'.
For that pane you can set a 'group by field' and I think that will do what you are asking for.


In my crystal ball I can see two wishes coming forth from this thread:

1. Make that right panel automatically appear/disappear when clicking on an album so it behaves the same as the extended panel.

2. Have a 'group by field' option added to the extended panel.

Thalion Korvhas

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Generally, regardless of the reason I would avoid "overloading" something as fundamental as the Artist tag with additional information that doesn't really belong there. The mastering or release details are pertinent to the album, not the artist. It might seem like a way to achieve a desired outcome, but starting down that path will only cause you more grief in the long run.

As for achieving what you want, I'd create a custom tag and set it as the track sub-grouping header in either Albums or Album and Tracks view.

I have tried to make the albums sort not only by artist/album but by mastering. But I cannot make it group them together by mastering. I tired to create a new sorting / grouping tag based on Album Mastering (see grouping in the screenshot): https://imgur.com/bjuPmTw

Then I tried to make the main panel also sort on it, but there is no option to do so: https://imgur.com/C566Vzy

I end up with this side by side that is not what I want: https://imgur.com/EF0bTaN


The first album= mastering 1
The second album= mastering 2
The third album= mastering 1
The fourth album= mastering 2

This is what I mean when the album versions are side by side. This is not the grouping I want to see. If I had 10 mastering versions, then all 10 of the first album would be side by side, etc.

I have the sorting option set in grouping, so how do I make the main panel group by mastering in addition to album / artist?
Last Edit: September 25, 2019, 01:27:41 AM by Thalion Korvhas

psychoadept

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I have tried to make the albums sort not only by artist/album but by mastering. But I cannot make it group them together by mastering. I tired to create a new sorting / grouping tag based on Album Mastering (see grouping in the screenshot): https://imgur.com/bjuPmTw

This part is working as it's supposed to. You're getting a distinct album for each mastering.

Quote
Then I tried to make the main panel also sort on it, but there is no option to do so: https://imgur.com/C566Vzy

This particular view doesn't support what you're trying to do. You need to be able to sort by something like Artist / Album Mastering / Year (which you can also set up in Sorting/Grouping). Maybe try the album covers view, grouped by Album Artist.
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Thalion Korvhas

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This particular view doesn't support what you're trying to do. You need to be able to sort by something like Artist / Album Mastering / Year (which you can also set up in Sorting/Grouping). Maybe try the album covers view, grouped by Album Artist.

Once again I find that I am beating my head against the limitations of the software. In album view this all works. There is an option to group by album - artist - album mastering where in the artist view there was not that option. by using the album view, it will group each mastering together in its own grouping (which is what I want). Sadly, I prefer the artist view above all other views for it's convenience. Maybe one day we can have grouping functionality in artist view that is deeper than two levels. A 3 or 4 level option would really expand that views functionality.

Thanks for your help, you are once again much more knowledgeable than I am with musicbee limitations.

Zak

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Your latest screenshots aren't working so I'm still not sure what you're trying to do.

My suggestion was for something like this:



Each artist appears once, and when selected each of their albums appears once.
In my example tracks for the selected album are separated by disc number, but I thought in your case you could use the mastering details there instead.
That way each album only appears once, with all tracks from all versions below it.
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smann

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In Edit Preferences > Tags (1) > Custom Tags, I have the following...

Custom 1 - "Subtitle" - Subtitle
Custom 2 - "Set Subtitle" - Set Subtitle
Custom 3 - "Sort Set Subtitle - Save to MusicBee database only

Example of Preferences

Subtitle is used for songs with broken down titles. For example, Green Day's Jesus of Suburbia is broken down into 5 different titles. So I have the Title set as "Jesus of Suburbia" and the Subtitle set as "I. Jesus of Suburbia; II. City of the Damned; III. I Don't Care; IV. Dearly Beloved; V. Tales of Another Broken Home". I then have the track details at the top where the now playing bar is set to "$IsNull(<Subtitle>,<Title>,<Title>"  ◦  "<Subtitle>)".

Example of Subtitle Implementation

Set Subtitle is used for naming either Disc Subtitles or Album Sections. For example, Incubus' Monuments and Melodies has Disc 1 labeled "Monuments" and Disc 2 labeled "Melodies". And Sonic Syndicate's Eden Fire album is split into 3 sections. See below...

Example for Incubus
Example for Sonic Syndicate

And finally the Sort Set Subtitle is used to help sort the stuff.


Now on to what you were asking regarding the multiple album types. This is typically how I handle them. I name them the same album, then I use the Set Subtitle to name it ("High-Resolution Audio" in the example below), and use Sort Set Subtitle to set it as "Version 2" or so. I do the same for remastered albums. I then uncheck the one I don't need synced to my phone.

Example of Multiple Types for Same Album

You could also label the disc numbers as 1.1, 1.2, 1.3 or 1a, 1b, 1c, but be careful because most other music players can't recognize anything except whole numbers.

I use the following virtual tag as the track sub-grouping "$IsNull(<Album>,<Set Subtitle>,<Album>$IsNull(<Set Subtitle>,,"  ◦  "{font: Segoe UI Semibold;Italic;9}<Set Subtitle>))" in order to show the different headers for each part.

I really hope this all made sense as I just finalized how I wanted all of this to show up in my library about a week ago haha
Last Edit: September 28, 2019, 03:09:50 AM by smann

The Incredible Boom Boom

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I think I understand what you're asking for and trying to explain, but I'm not exactly sure, which is why my simple answer may or not provide you with the result you want, but you could use a virtual tag to sort by an original year tag? For FLAC files, MusicBee uses <ORIGYEAR>. <ORIGINALYEAR> is the ID3v2.3 tag for mp3s. Currently, my albums are sorted by release year, so remastered albums are out of place, but in a few days or weeks I'll make a tag that sorts them by <ORIGYEAR> if present.

Thalion Korvhas

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Your latest screenshots aren't working so I'm still not sure what you're trying to do.

My suggestion was for something like this:



Each artist appears once, and when selected each of their albums appears once.
In my example tracks for the selected album are separated by disc number, but I thought in your case you could use the mastering details there instead.
That way each album only appears once, with all tracks from all versions below it.

I am interested in exactly how you were able to "double tier" the disc 1 & disc 2 like that under a single album. That looks promising.

Zak

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In the artwork views you can click on the view heading and select Customise Panel... and then set a tag as the Sub-grouping header:



I have a virtual tag that displays disc numbers and/or names if applicable, but I thought you could do something similar for your different mastering details.

As long as all the other album details are the same they will appear together under a single album cover, with all the different versions included. Also handy is that you can click on the grouping header to select just those tracks, so it would be easy to play just the version you want.
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Thalion Korvhas

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Ok, I did something somewhat interesting. Ignore the fact that the two "albums" are not really the same album with two different masterings (I just messed around with the first double disc I had).

https://imgur.com/3nyd9iW

Being inspired by Zak's disc layout above, I decided to play around with the disc tags. I had never messed with those before. I renamed the two albums the same album, then in the disc tag field, I added whatever title that I wanted for each album to force it to sort in the order I wanted (original master on top, remasters below, etc). For the original master i used  # in the name so that it would always sort to the top. Then for multiple remasters I would have to choose a name that would force them to sort vertically as I wanted them to. Ascending numbers would probably work. I then went into arrange panels \ main panel \ files \ show settings \ sub-grouping header. There I chose Album Mastering. And viola! it works.

This may not be the most efficient or elegant way to do this, but it is a cheap way of doing this. The main problem is I cannot just double click the album or it will load all tracks. So if I want to only listen to one version I will have to hand select the tracks.

<edit> I was typing this up as Zak was replying =). Thanks for the help!
Last Edit: October 03, 2019, 07:27:49 AM by Thalion Korvhas

Thalion Korvhas

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Also handy is that you can click on the grouping header to select just those tracks, so it would be easy to play just the version you want.

Sweet. This helps with the issue I stated above regarding not being able to just double click the album. Thanks for the inspiration!

Ideally, I wish that when you used the artist view, chose an artist, & when the album covers appeared all lined up horizontally, I wish Steven would add functionally to add more than one row of albums based on your sorting criteria. I think that would be pretty ideal. So if I had 3 different masterings of the same albums, when I chose the artist, then 3 rows of albums would appear instead of the standard one row. Each row would be a different mastering.