Author Topic: Proposed (optional) changes for simplified layout  (Read 102197 times)

redwing

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here is my take on this proposal

The options of hiding header/status bar (and even caption bar) were already suggested. The only unique point in your proposal is remove location bar and hide search box, but I don't see how it would work better than having the both in one box as in Steven's final mockup.

redwing

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as to the back/forward buttons and search box, yes they could go into the main panel bar for the 2nd layout and i might still do that
+1

Here is my proposal with several optional layouts:


Ulf

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Having used MB for some time, I would like to ask if this new optional layout, is optional?
Meaning will I be able to retain MB's current layout, after the introduction of this new
"simplified" layout?

Reason, I favour none of the proposed new layout's for MB, so far...   as all of them are bug
ugly an intrusive.

My main objection, being the way the left panel is messed by having for example the search
buttons stuck across the top of it.

Make changes to the centre and right panels, if you have to, but leave the left side
as it is (from top to bottom).


Ulf

mikebo

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here is my take on this proposal

The options of hiding header/status bar (and even caption bar) were already suggested. The only unique point in your proposal is remove location bar and hide search box, but I don't see how it would work better than having the both in one box as in Steven's final mockup.

Well it's not just hiding the search box, it's just been moved to a different place. This gives more space to tabs and user buttons, and people who don't use these features, can hide the header bar and still have access to search, which is imo essential.

Unification of search box and location box is an interesting idea, but so far no explanation was given as to how the user will know that functionality is there.
Last Edit: June 23, 2014, 03:28:54 PM by mikebo

Steven

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i'm not really happy with the direction of the feedback on this topic and its probably a good indicator that only minimal changes should be made - seeing other applications change their interface, time and again it only leads to abusive comments and negativity (i am definitely not saying thats the case here on this forum but just what is likely to happen if it were released).

I think the biggest benefit to be gained is when the multiple tabs are horizontal in the main panel (wasteful of space) and removal of the location bar (duplicating information). So probably the only thing i will do is remove the location bar so its entered in the search box for the cases where you need to enter a web-link and secondly for the default layout show a single tab in place of the location bar (layout 1 without extending the main panel bar across the left side).

mikebo

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layout 1 without extending the main panel bar across the left side
The feedback was rather positive on that.

Alumni

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I believe this new layout is a step in the right direction.
Last Edit: June 23, 2014, 03:14:02 PM by Alumni

psychoadept

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layout 1 without extending the main panel bar across the left side
The feedback was rather positive on that.

I'm not sure which way you mean, but either way it was mixed.  Some would prefer it extend to the left side, others don't want to lose the vertical space for the sidebar.
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mikebo

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@scampbll: I meant most people responded positively to extending the header bar over the left panel, except for you and Ulf if i didn't miss anyone.

redwing

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I'm a bit surprised that extending the header bar over the left panel, among all things, started picking up negative reactions. This change has been requested by many users. I think the following quote by lnminente summarizes the case well.

Well, sad to say but its the option i would like most :/ It's not only space in a bar, i see it hierarchycally more important, it has the search bar, command buttons, address box to know if you are browsing an album, with filters or not, or a folder in your computer, and that needs space. Also would give you the efficency of a fast click in the back button because you always will know exactly where it is. I see all that has a lot more importance than an entry easily scrollable with the wheel mouse at side panels. Also see it as the menu button, it has to be always there, not moving, for hierarchy and for efficency too.

And for consistency with the most used apps with tabs:
Firefox:

Chrome:

Again Firefox, being this capture from a library browser having direct relation with MB:


Also windows explorer has the back button at a fixed place and later is the side panel:


Of course, everyone has the right to say. And this is not about who's right and who's wrong.

But the fact is whatever change (even no change) is made it won't satisfy everyone. So I'm for keeping up this discussion ultimately for some real changes.

Ulf

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Why is it necessary to make MB look an function like a browser or the OS file explorer, by intruding
into and removing space from the left panel, to have this functionallity, when it is already exists
in the centre panel?

Surely the overall layout can be simplified, improved, without messing with the inntutive functionallity
of the left panel.


Ulf

psychoadept

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I mean, I'm not going to get bent out of shape if this change is made.  But I agree with Ulf that how other programs do things is not a persuasive argument.  I also get why some people would prefer it to change.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is that moving the navigation buttons to the outside edge of the window puts them even closer to player controls if the player is at the top, which kind of invites accidental clicks.
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mikebo

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Why is it necessary to make MB look an function like a browser or the OS file explorer, by intruding
into and removing space from the left panel, to have this functionallity, when it is already exists
in the centre panel?
I don't think it's necessary, but ui that is consistent with other widely used programs will be more familiar and easier to navigate. Though in this particular case i don't think either layout will be confusing just because the header bar extends over the panel or not.

Surely the overall layout can be simplified, improved, without messing with the inntutive functionallity
of the left panel.
How would this take anything away from the "inntutive functionallity" of the left panel?


While i was against extending the header bar in the past, now with tabs taking place of location entry box there is a good reason to make some more room horizontally, while sacrificing a little space of the left panel.

SimonBRT

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This is clearly starting to become a divisive topic so I don't blame Steven if he wants to play it safe.

I do have to say though, that personally I fall heavily in favour of of extending the header bar to over the left panel.  I use MB by keeping several tabs open at all times.  Some of these have the left panel collapsed, and some expanded, depending on the purpose of that tab.  I have always found it to be one of the strangest and most frustrating quirks of MB that as I switch between tabs, the back/forward buttons jump left and right.  It just isn't logical and it certainly isn't intuitive.  I still find this catching me out (with my mouse wandering to the incorrect location) even after years of daily MB use.

The feedback on this particular part of the proposed changes DID start positively and, to be honest, I do not understand how the loss of a few mm of vertical space for the left panel could even be considered an issue.

Doing things the way other programs do it may not be an argument in and of itself, but surely it is indicative that many others have thought through similar design problems and come out with the same solution.  UI elements/buttons that do not remain in a consistent location simply make no sense.  It is a shame that this thread has descended into so much negativity and resistance to change.  Of course not every solution will work for every person, Steven has repeatedly stated that these options would be just that, options.  This flexibility is something he has somehow managed to keep with almost every reworking of key aspects of the program in the past.  Yes, it has led to a large amount of options that may not be apparent out of the box, but that core usability has always remained, all the while adding more and more excellent features for us hardcore users and settings tweakers.  All of these changes have been guided by a forum that fostered and encouraged change with helpful and thoughtful feedback.  Lets not lose that.

psychoadept

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I feel strongly about vertical space because I have a very small amount of it.  I haven't meant any of my comments to be particularly negative.  I'm looking forward to trying this change out.  This discussion just reflects the differences in how we're all used to using the program.

I particularly like the proposal of putting all the tabs and toolbar elements in the caption bar.  Someone said they thought it looked crowded, but if you want to talk about how other programs are doing things, they're putting tabs in the caption bar.  That's what would create more space on my screen.
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