Author Topic: foobar2000/Winamp-style queue system  (Read 15794 times)

blackwind

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In MusicBee, the Now Playing list is your playlist. Looking at Foobar again now, I see it has a library where tracks are selected and a playlist to send them to for playback. How is that any different?

You can achieve the behavior I'm describing by creating an auto-playlist of your library, loading the foo_queuecontents plugin, and adding its panel to your layout.

That's why you wouldn't really load your entire library into the Now Playing list (unless you actually wanted to listen to every single song you have).

I do, in fact, want to listen to every single song I have.

In fb2k (and previously, in Winamp), I create an auto-playlist from my library, enable shuffle, and begin playback. When I want to listen to a specific song, I use a hotkey to load Media Library Search (or JTFE in Winamp), hammer out the song title, and hit enter. When I want to queue a specific song, I do the same thing, but hit "queue" instead rather than restoring the application and rooting around through my library. When I want to listen to the rest of the current album, I use a hotkey to disable shuffle. When I want to skip three tracks ahead in an album while shuffle is enabled, I use a hotkey that disables shuffle, skips to the next track, and re-enables shuffle -- three taps, and I'm on the song I want. Predictable behavior enables rapid-fire workflows like this, while the current MusicBee queuing paradigm will only slow me down.

When I'm not managing my library, I want my library management program out of the way. Again, there are many, many reasons I'd like to migrate over from fb2k, but I don't believe I should have to spend my day looking at MusicBee to accomplish simple playback tasks.

I'd suggest spending more time using MusicBee to get used to its way of doing things before asking for such a major change just because it's slightly different to how other programs do things.

Actually, as ma_t14 points out, all the requisite functionality is already present -- all that would be needed is an "Enable Now Playing?" checkbox, which, when unchecked, would move the queue numbers from "Now Playing" to playlist views and replace "Now Playing" with a queue contents editor (as in foo_queuecontents or JTFE).

I think the important thing to consider here is not the audacity of my request, but rather, how many potential users are being turned away from MusicBee every day because of this and *don't* come to the forum to complain or suggest a better way. By simply including an option for what I'm suggesting, that's one less barrier to entry. Surely that has to be a good thing?
/bw

Zak

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When I want to listen to a specific song, I use a hotkey to load Media Library Search (or JTFE in Winamp), hammer out the song title, and hit enter. When I want to queue a specific song, I do the same thing, but hit "queue" instead rather than restoring the application and rooting around through my library.
The Now Playing Assistant will do the same thing. Alt+J by default.
Bee excellent to each other...

beeing good

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how many potential users are being turned away from MusicBee every day because of this and *don't* come to the forum to complain or suggest a better way.

I don't imagine a lot are turning away because of that, quite the opposite in fact.
I can't see how adopting or adding a more convoluted system such as foobar's would improve musicbee. They're different programs and they function in different ways. As has been said, everything you've mentioned can be done already. Sounds like you need to play with musicbee more and become as at ease with it as you are with foobar. Or just stick to foobar if you prefer the way it works.

blackwind

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The Now Playing Assistant will do the same thing. Alt+J by default.

Yep, but that's only one small piece of the puzzle.

I don't imagine a lot are turning away because of that, quite the opposite in fact.

Well, we'll see how this thread turns out in the long-term, I guess. One way or the other, it should be damn near trivial to offer what I'm suggesting as an option, but if no further action is to be taken until a sufficient number of complainers come out of the woodwork, I look forward to their inevitable arrival.
/bw

basshead

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In MusicBee, the Now Playing list is your playlist. Looking at Foobar again now, I see it has a library where tracks are selected and a playlist to send them to for playback. How is that any different?

Nope, what I'm asking for is to have a small panel that looks like "Now Playing Assistant >> Play Queue" window in the right/left sidebar,
...
- so in short a panel with just the queued tracks, not the entire playlist which is about to play.
I'm confused. Isn't that what the Now Playing list is for?  ???

No is not. Look at the above pic again. Let's say I want to listen all 5 VA - Electro Swing albums. I double-click in Library Explorer on the Album Artist and I get all albums nicely sorted by [Year] Album in my Main Panel. After I listen few tracks, let's say I want to listen those 3 queued Parov Stelar songs then continue with Electro Swing albums from where I left.

Now the problem with Now Playing is that it shows all 100+ tracks I already have in my main panel. What I want is the Now Playing to show only the queued tracks. To be like a temporary playlist. I don't want to scroll via 100+ tracks in the Now Playing that I already have in my Main Panel.

I want to see only queued tracks in my Now Playing list, and after a track is played to be automatically deleted from the Now Playing list. After all queued tracks are played the Now Playing list should be empty and the player should to resume to the next track from my main panel. (In other words, a option to hide all tracks in Now Playing list that are not queued)

Pingaware

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No is not. Look at the above pic again. Let's say I want to listen all 5 VA - Electro Swing albums. I double-click in Library Explorer on the Album Artist and I get all albums nicely sorted by [Year] Album in my Main Panel. After I listen few tracks, let's say I want to listen those 3 queued Parov Stelar songs then continue with Electro Swing albums from where I left.

Now the problem with Now Playing is that it shows all 100+ tracks I already have in my main panel. What I want is the Now Playing to show only the queued tracks. To be like a temporary playlist. I don't want to scroll via 100+ tracks in the Now Playing that I already have in my Main Panel.

I want to see only queued tracks in my Now Playing list, and after a track is played to be automatically deleted from the Now Playing list. After all queued tracks are played the Now Playing list should be empty and the player should to resume to the next track from my main panel. (In other words, a option to hide all tracks in Now Playing list that are not queued)

But any tracks you want to play are queued tracks. So as I understand it, you're saying you want to be able to make a sort of "queue within a queue" list. Which seems like a lot of effort to go to when you could just queue those three songs next, let them play and then let the albums continue playing as before.
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jistme

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Hey blackwind.

Welcome to the forum.
Reading your postings the last few days, it's obvious you have a lot of knowledge, ideas and experience to bring in here. And the fact you are taking the effort to make your points and explain them further is great.

But just to be honest with you, the way you present some of it might prove to become counterproductive. Wordings like 'it should be such', 'it should behave like that' etc., and speaking for others that are not even active in this forum at all (so for arguments sake imaginary people) would not have my personal preference.

I'm not saying this to 'reprimand' or something (hey, I'm nobody and also kind of imaginary).
I am really only mentioning this so your ideas and suggestions will get the attention and possibly the implementation they deserve. Maybe you even have the ability to create some plugins in the future?

Maybe you also have some nice things to say about MB? If this is all a little difficult, then maybe it would indeed be better to stick with software you are used to?

Enjoy!


edit:
Sorry basshead, I messed it up a little, and addressed you at first.
(all those new bees ;-)
Last Edit: July 20, 2013, 04:33:58 PM by jistme

Anti

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Having just read this thread, I don't think people are being clear enough about what feature they're using
or how they're trying to use it. People are using the word 'queue' with cross-purposes, for example.

For sake of clarity....

There are three features being talked about:

(1) The 'now-playing' node (located at the top of the Playlist panel), which displays in the main pane.
(2) The 'now-playing list', which can be enabled in the left or right panel.
(3) The 'now-playing assistant'(which includes the 'now-playing' list and a special 'play queue' list).

The now-playing node (1) COLLATES tracks from several sources (Eg. static and auto playlists, Auto-DJ, and manually selected tracks) into one long list of queued tracks. MB either plays through the list of tracks using the 'play order' number in the # column, or it randomly picks 'play order' numbers when 'shuffle' is enabled.

The 'now-playing list' (2) is a mirror of the node, but it doesn't have the sorting and grouping options that the node has. Its main purpose is to display your queued tracks in a side panel when you haven't got the now-playing node selected.

with shuffle disabled
If you want to re-order/remove/add tracks in the now-playing queue, you should be doing it in the now-playing node or panel, and you should actually be dragging the tracks into the order that you wish. You should NOT be using the 'queue next' right-click option that puts blue box next to a track (which over-rides the 'play order' number) because when that blue list exits, MB will just carry on down the list from wherever the last blue box was.

with shuffle enabled
Obviously shuffle means 'play the now-playing list in an unordered, random way'.
But sometimes while shuffle is on, you want some temporary order and control in the middle of the randomness.
However, dragging tracks to order them into a desired sequence is not going to work (because shuffle chooses random 'play order' numbers).
That is what the 'blue-box' system is for.
You can choose 'queue next' directly in the now-playing pane/panel, putting a numbered blue-box beside the tracks, which then temporarily over-rides the shuffle. However your blue-boxes may be scattered throughout the list in an unordered fashion (since you cannot order the list by the blue-box column). That is why the 'now-playing assistant' (3) is there to help you. Its main purpose is to display the blue-box sequence for you in the 'play queue' pane so you can review and refine the sequence more easily.
Finally, because shuffle is enabled it doesn't matter where the blue-list exits; MB just keeps shuffling as it did before the 'interruption'.

'now playing assistant' confusion
The 'now playing assistant' also allows you to add tracks to the now-playing list, and I think this is why people are getting confused about the assistant's purpose and usage.

The biggest confusion seems to be not understanding how the blue-box 'play queue' is different from the 'now-playing' queue, and that normally you shouldn't need to use the 'play queue' system unless you regularly insert ordered tracks whilst shuffling.

The next biggest confusion seems to be that the 'play now' and 'queue next' behaviours are different depending on where and what you're right-clicking on in the assistant, which also differs from the behaviour when you right-click in the main pane or the 'now-playing list' panel. But the differences make sense if you understand the assumptions MB is making about why you're clicking in a certain pane/panel/window.

If in any doubt, you should be editing your queued tracks directly in the now-playing node/panel - it's more powerful, easier to understand, and has consistent behaviour. Forget about the Assistant unless you have used the blue-box system to order some tracks whilst shuffling and want to review the sequence.

Apologies if you read all that and didn't learn anything new!
Last Edit: July 22, 2013, 02:34:54 AM by Anti

C403

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I for one am totally in favor of the current system. It might not be intuitive for F2k/Winamp users, but once you get used to it it's quite powerful.

Xyzzy

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Having dabbled a lot with foobar2000, I find MusicBee approach much more convenient, logical and intuitive.

-1