Author Topic: Does anybody know what 'playlist' and 'library' mean?  (Read 4794 times)

hiccup

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7880
I don't.

These two concepts, both in digital music in general, and in MusicBee specifically to me maintain to be a source of confusion in what they mean when, where, and in what context.

Library

Playlist

Library can indicate the concept or an index of an assembly of music, the actual music files, or some vague reference to either.
Playlist can indicate a single file that only contains an index of songs, or it can refer to an assembly of actual audio files, or it can be some vague reference to either.

So when somebody says something like "copy your library" or "synchronise playlist" it is never completely clear what that actually means.

I am still not sure if this is an English language problem, a general 'digital music' problem, or a MusicBee problem.
But I think it is a problem.

This has come up before in regards to MusicBee in this forum, and suggestions were made, but nothing ever came from it.

I am curious if others are (still) as bothered about this as me, have opinions on this, or even better, have specific suggestions to improve or solve this.
At least for as far as it pertains to MusicBee and this forum.

phred

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9353
Interesting.

I have no issue with playlist. It is a list of songs that are grouped together by some user-created criteria. I find no ambiguity in the term or the definition.

Library on the other hand can be confusing. Up until the time I started using MB, I thought of my collection of music as my library. Be it vinyl, tape (8 track, cassette, reel-to-reel) or digital. MB has turned that on it's head. Within MB, the term library refers to the directory in which all the data for the music collection. From the beginning I thought this was a poor choice of words. Over the years, I've accepted that use of the word and have gotten used to it. But new users see a comment such as 'where is your library stored?" and the first thing they think of is where are their music files located.

So yes, the use of 'library' as used within MB (the program and the forum) can be confusing for new users. But I think it's too late to change the terminology since MB has evolved in to such a mature application. I certainly would not fight a change in the term - perhaps to database - but at this point it's no big deal for me.
Download the latest MusicBee v3.5 or 3.6 patch from here.
Unzip into your MusicBee directory and overwrite existing files.

----------
The FAQ
The Wiki
Posting screenshots is here
Searching the forum with Google is  here

Zak

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2459
Caveat
I've thought about this question much longer than I meant to, but I also can't be bothered editing it any more now.
So I apologise in advance if it sounds a bit ranty or condescending.


Library can indicate the concept or an index of an assembly of music, the actual music files, or some vague reference to either.
Playlist can indicate a single file that only contains an index of songs, or it can refer to an assembly of actual audio files, or it can be some vague reference to either.

I don't see the current terminology as an issue, and I think your definitions are broader than intended for MusicBee.

Playlist

A Playlist is a single file containing a list of audio files (e.g. a .pls or .m3u file). Anyone using it to refer to the original files contained within it is using the word incorrectly.
The term Playlist pre-dates computerised music and is now used in every media application, mobile app, or streaming web site, so changing it would be out of the question.

Library

Library is a common term in any application that stores information about a collection of items, physical or digital. The analogy of going to a physical library and choosing from a broad selection of books remains a good one. You could search for a book by its title, author, subject etc., just as there are many ways to view and choose from your music. I don't think anyone could come up with another term that explained the concept more clearly.

Within MusicBee (and on the forum) its use is somewhat fuzzy, but I think the term should only apply in the conceptual sense.
To clarify the distinction, consider this example.

If all of your files are stored in the folder "C:\Music", some people might refer to that folder as containing their "library". It's certainly true that if you look at an album in Album and Tracks view, each row (i.e. track) will correspond to a file on a disk somewhere (ignoring cue sheets etc.). However, MusicBee will also let you browse your Library by Artist, or Composer, or Year or Genre, or any number of other criteria that have no relationship to the folder structure or files on your computer.

So while someone could reasonably say "I have 1,000 songs in my library" and use it to mean the number of files, no such relationship can be inferred if they say "I have 100 artists in my library".

For this reason - to use one of your own examples - instructing someone to "copy their library" is confusing, but it's the incorrect use of the word that's confusing, not the word itself.  


etc.

Phred mentioned the term database, but that should only ever refer to the actual MusicBeeLibrary.mbl file, since that is a literal description of it.

For the majority of questions asked on the forum where people have trouble understanding the replies given, I'd argue those questions are being asked by casual users who don't necessarily have a long history of working with computers and digital files. If there's any confusion there, changing the names of things won't make it any less so.
People migrating from iTunes seem to be more likely to have questions about the "library". I've never used iTunes but I think it must have been much more restrictive about where your music files were stored. Does it require all songs to be "imported" before they can be played? So iTunes users probably never had to worry about such things when they were using it.

Finally, MusicBee is obviously a very powerful program but with great power comes great respon... er... complexity. It's come a long way over many years thanks to Steven's amazing work and willingness to listen to all kinds of feedback, but it still has some way to go before it's truly accessible to everyone in the way say iTunes or MediaPlayer are.
Bee excellent to each other...

hiccup

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7880
I have no issue with playlist. It is a list of songs that are grouped together by some user-created criteria. I find no ambiguity in the term or the definition.

A Playlist is a single file containing a list of audio files (e.g. a .pls or .m3u file).

I (could) rest my case ;-)

Zak

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2459
We've described it differently, but I'm pretty sure we're saying the same thing there.
Bee excellent to each other...

hiccup

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7880
We've described it differently, but I'm pretty sure we're saying the same thing there.

I read phred's sentence as if he meant a group of actual song files. I may be wrong.

What if somebody says: "copy the playlist to your phone".
Would that mean only copy the single .pls file to the phone without the actual music?

phred

  • Global Moderator
  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 9353
I read phred's sentence as if he meant a group of actual song files. I may be wrong.
You're not wrong. That's exactly what I meant. If we're talking about life in general, and not just MB, then that's what a playlist is (in my mind.) No matter what media the music is on.

More years ago than I care to remember, I was a radio DJ and each week the Program Directer issued what was called that week's playlist or rotation. It was a typed list of all the songs that we were "allowed" to play that week.

Quote
What if somebody says: "copy the playlist to your phone".
Would that mean only copy the single .pls file to the phone without the actual music?
This is where the age of computers enters and screws up everything. If someone told me to "copy the playlist to my phone" I would take it to mean the .pls file plus all the music files referenced therein. Otherwise I would state "copy the playlist file.
 
Quote from: Merriam-Webster
a list of recordings to be played on the air by a radio station. Also: a similar list used for organizing a personal digital music collection
And then adds:
Quote from: Merriam-Webster
First known use of playlist: 1972, in the meaning defined above
Download the latest MusicBee v3.5 or 3.6 patch from here.
Unzip into your MusicBee directory and overwrite existing files.

----------
The FAQ
The Wiki
Posting screenshots is here
Searching the forum with Google is  here

Terry Walker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 92
For me, the library is general, while the playlist is something you can differentiate or rename a list on your preference.

Terry Walker

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 92
I do not have many issues with the playlist, I am enjoying every bit of it.

Mayibongwe

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1058
  • Heal The World
This has come up before in regards to MusicBee in this forum...
Haha, read this thread once and didn't think much of it back then, but here we are again:

It would appear that you don't understand what playlists are. As I stated one or two replies above, playlists are ONLY text files.
They DO NOT contain the actual music file, but rather provide the path (a pointer) to where the actual music file is located.

_____________


Library can indicate the concept or an index of an assembly of music, the actual music files...
Playlist can indicate a single file that only contains an index of songs, or it can refer to an assembly of actual audio files...
To me as well, both descriptions can mean either of those depending on the context.
Neither is truer over the other in my opinion .
I already spend hours on end on social media. Might as well spare a few of those to a greater purpose here.

hiccup

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 7880
Neither is truer over the other in my opinion .
Yeah, it's a big flaw in the English language.
The Inuit language has 500 words for playlist.
I am guessing the Russian language has at least 20.
Japanese maybe 10?

Maybe it's time to move the forum to use another language?