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General => MusicBee Wishlist => Topic started by: redwing on November 19, 2014, 08:33:22 AM

Title: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 19, 2014, 08:33:22 AM
Originated from here: http://getmusicbee.com/forum/index.php?topic=8435.0

Currently if a filter or a (auto)playlist is set to a specific view, the view gets locked, and there's no way to change the view because other view options are grayed out. I think the user should be able to change to other views when needed, given that clicking on the node again will always take it back to the original view. If not default, then please offer an option to unlock views for filters and playlists. This is different from "default" view in that it allows to use for filters and playlists custom views of different column sets and a preferred (but overridable) view.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Zak on November 19, 2014, 12:04:31 PM
I always thought it was a bit strange/annoying that having assigned a view to a playlist or filter it isn't possible to change it later. The saved view should only be the initial view and the user can change it later if they need, to suit what they're doing.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: boroda on November 19, 2014, 12:21:15 PM
+1
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: vzell on November 19, 2014, 01:01:06 PM
+1
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 19, 2014, 06:38:07 PM
While i appreciate the suggestion makes it easier to change the view, i dont understand the comments saying it isnt possible to change the locked view. Just re-edit the playlist or filter definition and change it there
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 19, 2014, 08:49:39 PM
While i appreciate the suggestion makes it easier to change the view, i dont understand the comments saying it isnt possible to change the locked view. Just re-edit the playlist or filter definition and change it there

You don't mean that users have to re-define the view selection to another "locked" view every time they want to switch to another view, do you? The request here is not to gray out other view options ("unlock views") and allow to switch to another view when the user wants to. I don't understand why it has to be "locked" to the selected view.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 19, 2014, 09:14:05 PM
yes because a "locked view" is the intention of that playlist/ filter view setting and the grayed out menu makes it clear the value is locked.
As i said i dont understand why people are saying it isnt possible to change the value and really, it isnt very hard to change the view depite how this is being presented by some posts on this topic.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 19, 2014, 09:53:04 PM
What I'm saying is that it doesn't have to be "locked" to achieve the purpose of the view setting. Just make the view a "default", "initial" view of the filter/playlist so that clicking on the node will always return it to the view. What would the downsides be you think if the view selection is unlocked?

Again, changing to another "locked" view is pointless. Yes, it's hard to re-save the view setting every time, compared with switching to another view using a hotkey or toolbar button.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 19, 2014, 09:55:19 PM
+1

As long as I've been using MusicBee, custom/locked views still throw me for a loop.

For instance, say I have my Classical filter set to a custom Track Details view, but I decide I temporarily want to view my Classical filter in Artwork view.  I have a couple of choices: I can edit the filter to "Default" and apply Artwork, then reconfigure the default artwork view to look the way I want for Classical.  That will affect any other views using Defaut, which I probably don't want.  Or I can edit the filter to "Artwork", so then when I configure it, it only affects that filter (I think?).  In the first case, I can easily switch back to my custom view using the layout menu - but then, again, that switches ALL Default views.  In the second case, I have to edit the filter again to switch back.

So in order not to mess up any other views, I have to edit the filter at least twice.  That means right click > open filter > change > save, right click > open > change  > save, rather than click > select, click > select in the layout menu.  (And as much as I've messed with custom views, I'm also still not even sure I have this right.)

Maybe rather than having it in the layout menu, views could be a right click menu item for filters and playlists, so you could change them individually without having to open the whole configuration screen.  (I would much rather have each filter/playlist just remember its own settings and custom views be more like static templates you can apply, but that seems to be just me.)

Edit: Or maybe better than cluttering up the right click menus more, offer a GLOBAL setting for each playlist/filter to remember its last view, rather than having to set them all to "default" if you want to switch views quickly, and then having them all change together.  I'm not sure, I tend to get confused when I try to think this through.  I can write convoluted library templates, but I can't seem to get my head around how the views work - which is why I think simpler is better.  One thing for sure is I would like to see it work consistently between all filters, nodes, static playlists, and auto-playlists, including the main library filter.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Bee-liever on November 20, 2014, 11:18:40 AM
Maybe a compromise would be the ability to set a 'default' view that was used when "Default" was selected.   That set 'default' view would be used as the starting view for any "Default" setting views and no view changes would be automatically saved.  Then, when you wanted to view a playlist/filter in a different view, it wouldn't change the "Default" view for other unlocked playlist/filters. They would revert to the set 'default' view when re-opened.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 20, 2014, 05:32:43 PM
i've changed it so you can now change the view from the panel layout button.
It effective changes the "locked" view in the playlist or filter

http://musicbee.niblseed.com/V2_5/MusicBee_Exe_Patched.zip
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 20, 2014, 10:28:54 PM
Thanks for the change! Now it's great to be able to change a view easily.

But one thing I don't get is how non-default column sets are handled. Say, you set the view setting to "Album & Tracks". You temporarily switch it to Track Details. But the column set for Track Details view is different from the one for default view. With custom views, you also get all different column sets from non-initial views. So how are these non-default column sets handled?

Also, the initially saved view setting for a node is constantly changing whenever it's switched to another view. I guess that's because you made it to change the "locked" view rather than allowing temporary view change while retaining the original view setting.

Now I'm not sure this change has made it any better than the previous at all.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 21, 2014, 04:13:54 AM
i've changed it so you can now change the view from the panel layout button.
It effective changes the "locked" view in the playlist or filter

http://musicbee.niblseed.com/V2_5/MusicBee_Exe_Patched.zip


*thumbs up*

Testing now. 


Update: This is WAY better, thank you.  Sorry, redwing, but I'm not sure where the issue is when you can switch views in a couple of clicks now.  I now have a classical details view and a classical artwork view and can switch between them at will.  Or go fool around with another view without fear of causing unwanted changes elsewhere.  :)  I think the key with the way this works is to use a lot of custom views (which I already have for almost everything).
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Bee-liever on November 21, 2014, 05:25:54 AM
Sorry, redwing, but I'm not sure where the issue is when you can switch views in a couple of clicks now.

I think redwing might be referring to the problem that if you change the view within any playlist set as "Default" view, all Default views still get changed.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 21, 2014, 05:43:13 AM
Sorry, redwing, but I'm not sure where the issue is when you can switch views in a couple of clicks now.

I think redwing might be referring to the problem that if you change the view within any playlist set as "Default" view, all Default views still get changed.

So it's the ones that aren't locked to a particular view?  Yeah, I can see where that would be a problem still, especially if something then does effectively get locked that wasn't before.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 21, 2014, 05:54:49 AM
Sorry for the confusions. What I meant was:

(1) Default column set for library nodes and the one for playlists are different, but now they're mixed. If you switch to another view with a non-default view library node, it takes default column set for playlists instead of the one for library nodes.

(2) Clicking on the node doesn't restore the originally saved specific view as switching views constantly updates the view setting of the node.

Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 21, 2014, 06:38:56 AM
Another issue is about custom views. Should they be handled in the same manner as the three views? What if custom views are independent of the three views?

Say, you created "Custom A" view in Track Details view and set "A" node to that custom view. Then you could switch, with the node, to any views, but selecting Track Details view will bring "Custom A" view. And hopefully clicking the node would do the same.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 22, 2014, 10:43:35 AM
For auto-playlists and filters its always been the case they maintain their own set of fields for each view, and same for static playlists if enabled, so for changing the view, including custom views is much more superficial and only changes the basic layout (track details, album & tracks, artwork).
I guess thats a bit confusing and leads to inconsistenty so i will have a look at that - and probably when the view is changed for an auto-playlists/filter, reset the fields when a new view is selected but there are quite a few things to think about with this and might require a recent change i made for updating custom views from playlists to be undone.

@redwing, i dont understand your very last post - perhaps its answered now
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Bee-liever on November 22, 2014, 11:27:10 AM
I'll just push my suggestion forward again  :)

If you could set a view as the "Default" view for playlist/filters, you could then look at these, in different views, without MB changing the "Default" view for all other playlists/filters. Re-opening them, they would reset to the saved "Default" view.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 22, 2014, 12:01:48 PM
I've been always using "default" view for all filters/playlists and this is almost first time for me trying other view settings. Now I understand each filter, just like an auto-playlist, remembers its own column set for each view if one of the three views (instead of "default " view) is selected. This works great and I don't see the need for creating any custom views. I'm going to test for a while.

BTW how to reset the column set to the default for a filter? If I switch to default view and switch back, then it still remembers its own column set.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 22, 2014, 03:41:18 PM
http://musicbee.niblseed.com/V2_5/MusicBee_Exe_Patched.zip

i have made one bug-fix, in the case when switching views in a playlist or filter, the custom fields were not being loaded. Thats corrected now.
So the behavior for auto-playlists, filters and static playlists with custom fields enabled is:
- the track details, album and tracks and artwork layout have their own fields unique to the playlist/filter (initialised to the current fields at the time the playlist is created)
- any changes to fields for those views only affect that playlist/ filter
- custom views always use the fields from the custom view and any changes to fields affects that custom view
- i realise thats not consistent but having unique fields to a playlist/ filter has been that way since day one and i cant change it now
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 22, 2014, 05:10:40 PM
If Artwork view is selected for view setting, the same settings are applied to all filters including displayed fields, group by, sort by setting. Can you make each filter to remember its own setting in artwork view as well?
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 22, 2014, 07:14:09 PM
that would require a substantial change so probably not
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 22, 2014, 09:24:49 PM
I haven't tested extensively, but I approve of the "default view" going away.  I think this change will make things a lot more consistent and predictable.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 23, 2014, 03:37:01 AM
Here are some suggestions to make it more consistent and predictable.

1. For filters/playlists, current view setting options are misleading since now switching views constantly updates the initially saved view setting. Change it to "default"  and "custom", plus the list of custom views created by the user.

2. When a new filter is created, its column set is inherited from the default view of library node instead of from default view of playlists. Likewise, when you change its view setting to custom, its column set shouldn't change and then you can start editing it to your liking. Currently, if you change the view setting to any of the three non-default views, it gets column set from default-view playlists instead of default-view library nodes. Because of that, you can't make any changes to initial column set with any library nodes, and that has to be done by editing column set of either defaut-view static playlists or auto-DJ node.

3. As you admitted, artwork view is the only exception to this unique-view-settings-per-node handling. Hence, disable "Copy current view settings to" command under panel layout button when artwork view is selected. That custom view doesn't do anything and is simply misleading.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 23, 2014, 06:15:04 AM
1. For filters/playlists, current view setting options are misleading since now switching views constantly updates the initially saved view setting. Change it to "default"  and "custom", plus the list of custom views created by the user.

Maybe this could even be removed from settings entirely?  Just start with the current main library view and have a note somewhere in the settings about which view is being used/what happens if you change it.


Quote
2. When a new filter is created, its column set is inherited from the default view of library node instead of from default view of playlists. Likewise, when you change its view setting to custom, its column set shouldn't change and then you can start editing it to your liking.

I agree, if you change a view to have its own unique settings, there shouldn't be any changes applied until you start making them.


Quote
Currently, if you change the view setting to any of the three non-default views, it gets column set from default-view playlists instead of default-view library nodes. Because of that, you can't make any changes to initial column set with any library nodes, and that has to be done by editing column set of either defaut-view static playlists or auto-DJ node.

Yes, initial views should come from the main library, maybe even only from the unfiltered main library.  That's a little tough, because I can see it would be hard for MB to figure out what the initial configuration should be when one of those is chosen.


Quote
3. As you admitted, artwork view is the only exception to this unique-view-settings-per-node handling. Hence, disable "Copy current view settings to" command under panel layout button when artwork view is selected. That custom view doesn't do anything and is simply misleading.

This makes sense.  It seems like sort/group by settings are retained in the custom view, but if that's all then maybe each filter/playlists could save its own settings for that, rather than bothering with custom views.


- any changes to fields for those views only affect that playlist/ filter
- custom views always use the fields from the custom view and any changes to fields affects that custom view
- i realise thats not consistent but having unique fields to a playlist/ filter has been that way since day one and i cant change it now

I don't think this is too confusing.  I would expect that if I have a "generic" view enabled that it wouldn't necessarily apply changes to another view, but that if it's a specific, saved view it would retain changes everywhere.  It might help if there were some note of explanation about it, though. 

(I'll try to update the wiki soon.  These changes might catch a few people off guard, but I think it's a huge improvement overall. Thank you!)
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 23, 2014, 11:31:06 AM
@psychoadept:

Default view and user-created custom views are all useful. You can have some filters to share the same column set even in different views (default view), and some to retain its own unique column set (custom), and some to share the same column set in a specific view (user-created custom views). What I meant in #3 is only confined to artwork view-based custom views because they don't do anything.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 23, 2014, 11:56:42 AM
@redwing, you should be able to copy the Artwork layout to a custom view and customise the fields.
What i meant was for playlists/ filters the normal artwork view doesnt save custom fields to the playlist/ filter like the normal Track Details and Album & Tracks views ie. when a playlist is set to Artwork layout, if you change the fields then its changed for the Artwork layout everywhere.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 23, 2014, 12:03:43 PM
Are there any differences in view settings (like displayed fields, group by, sort by setting) between default-view artwork view and any artwork view-based custom views? I don't think there's any (once you change them in any artwork view, they look all the same in any artwork-view nodes), and that's why I'm saying artwork view-based custom views don't do anything.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: Steven on November 23, 2014, 12:10:44 PM
A custom artwork view should be uniquely configurable as set in the Artwork Layout dialog, and any fields can be uniquely set there.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 23, 2014, 12:34:08 PM
OK, I see what you meant. It does do something when saved in non-default artwork view. Also I meant by "displayed fields" fields in expanded panel, but now I see you meant fields displayed under artwork. Looks like it saves sort by setting too, except group by setting.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 24, 2014, 02:39:39 PM
Maybe I should make myself clearer about these points.

1. For filters/playlists, current view setting options are misleading since now switching views constantly updates the initially saved view setting. Change it to "default"  and "custom", plus the list of custom views created by the user.

2. When a new filter is created, its column set is inherited from the default view of library node instead of from default view of playlists. Likewise, when you change its view setting to custom, its column set shouldn't change and then you can start editing it to your liking. Currently, if you change the view setting to any of the three non-default views, it gets column set from default-view playlists instead of default-view library nodes. Because of that, you can't make any changes to initial column set with any library nodes, and that has to be done by editing column set of either defaut-view static playlists or auto-DJ node.

Then each filter/playlist would be locked to one of view settings ("default",  "custom", or one of user-created custom views) until the user edits the setting again using Edit Filter pane. With whatever setting, it would be possible to switch between the three view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view), but if you open Edit Filter pane, it's always locked to its own view setting. So view setting (default/custom/user-created custom views) would be independent from view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view). If you open panel layout button for a node with user-created custom view setting, the button would show both one of view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view) and the name of the user-created custom view ticked. For default view nodes and custom view nodes, only one of the view options would be ticked.

With default view selected, filters will share the same column set for each view options. With custom view, each filter keeps its own column set for each view. With a user-created custom view, filters will share the same column set for a specific view and unique column set for the other views.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 24, 2014, 08:09:14 PM
Then each filter/playlist would be locked to one of view settings ("default",  "custom", or one of user-created custom views) until the user edits the setting again using Edit Filter pane. With whatever setting, it would be possible to switch between the three view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view), but if you open Edit Filter pane, it's always locked to its own view setting. So view setting (default/custom/user-created custom views) would be independent from view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view). If you open panel layout button for a node with user-created custom view setting, the button would show both one of view options (track details / album & tracks / artwork view) and the name of the user-created custom view ticked. For default view nodes and custom view nodes, only one of the view options would be ticked.

With default view selected, filters will share the same column set for each view options. With custom view, each filter keeps its own column set for each view. With a user-created custom view, filters will share the same column set for a specific view and unique column set for the other views.

I think I follow your thinking, but this seems unnecessarily complicated to me.  It makes more sense to me to have the basic views be defaults that have the same settings across filters, and use custom views for everything else.  You can always set a filter to one of the default views, then save it as a custom view before configuring it to your liking.  That will serve the same purpose of giving it unique settings, and it will be waiting for you if you try something else but want to switch back.  Plus you can still freely swtich between defaults and custom, without bothering with settings in the filter/playlist.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: redwing on November 25, 2014, 02:10:56 AM
That would be more complicated even than the current one because you will end up having lots of user-created custom views in various names. Currently you don't have to name a unique setting if you set a node to one of the three views for view setting (and my suggestion is to merge the three views into a single "custom" setting because that's what they actually do collectively).
Anyway, even an experienced user would need quite a time to figure out what's going on with the current view settings and column set handling.
Title: Re: "Unlock views" for filters and playlists
Post by: psychoadept on November 25, 2014, 05:36:38 AM
you will end up having lots of user-created custom views in various names

I guess I'm used to that, since it was previously the only way to get consistency of behavior.

I still think everything being totally independent is the least complicated way to go, but I also see that it's sometimes helpful to be able to copy view settings across multiple playlists, etc.  So maybe it should be the other way around: have all unique settings for the three generic views, and only replicate settings with custom views.  That does return us to the problem of what initial settings to use for the generic views, but I think using whatever the settings are for the main library would make sense.